Where I BS about King of Fighters XIV for awhile(AKA: A 'Review.')

Nake! Sakebe! Soshite shine!


So this Xmas I had found myself in possession of the new King of Fighters. 

First, a bit of history. 

King of Fighters was my absolute shit back in the day. I used to be pretty impressive at locals(they were all locals back then, let's face it), coming across KoF '95 in a Neo Geo cabinet next to my college the year it came out. It managed to get it pretty damn quickly too, as I remember playing it that year. (I started college in '95 and remember playing it the first time in the winter.)  

Through many years it sort of maintained a spot as my favorite 2D fighter, even over Street Fighter. I played SF semi-seriously, but I was really more of an SNK gal for a long time until Guilty Gear took over as my 2D game of choice later on down the line and moved into the favorite spot. I studied the game as well as we could back then with limited internet and no actual frame data(it was all just shared tech in those days), and was a fairly scary force in my time, if I could brag a bit. (this was long ago.) 

I was heavily into it in the Orochi saga('95 to '97), played a lot of '98 and '99, but wasn't as serious by '99 and just played it more for fun. I played the others casually, but at that point I was in my 'light play' mode. XI I picked up again semi-seriously, having settled overseas finally, but I was left cold by XII like many, and when XIII-continuing the story-left out some of my favorites like Adel(my literal tied-with-Iori favorite in the damn series), Gato and such(even though it kept other favorites), I was a little salty. I shouldn't have been that salty since my absolute old favorite hasn't left(Iori), but somehow I missed Gato and Adel a whole lot(at least Duo Lon was back.) I think the salt came from them actively putting Adel in the background but not playable after buttering him up as the co-main along with Ash. I have no idea why this irritated me but it did. I think WoW raiding was taking it's toll on my usual patient personality or something at the time. 

Anyway as time went on, my salt subsided, and I started to feel sort of dumb in the first place because who the hell gets salty at a game that keeps including their longtime favorite? An idiot, that's who. Ahh well, we all have our moments where we don't cover ourselves in glory. I mean, I wasn't real big on the NESTS saga but it didn't get me salty or anything. I think it came from the fact that as a writer, I felt Adel was a massively wasted opportunity and those tend to get me mad sometimes. Real mad. Real, REAL mad. 

(my dislike of XII, however, I can't say too much there. Didn't work too much for me.) 

With ALL of that out of the way, I wanted KoF for Xmas and I got it. Even got the steelbook edition!

And I gotta say short version: It's great, and if you like 2D fighters, I would absolutely suggest this. I mean, I'd say get this and Revelator over SFV for now. It's solid, it looks actually better than some of those pictures would make you think, it's fun, it has both competitive and casual content, and the developers really are taking care to make sure they take care of it. While some of the new cast are hit or miss, overall it's huge size and variety of content is well worth the money, and the game deserves more players and a bigger community. 

So the longer version! This is going to be in my Azzy-style 'bullshit session' style of review than some technical thing, where I basically shoot around and sorta just chat about aspects of the game before wrapping it up. No numerical scores or anything like that. On that note...

For a rundown-50 fighters, teams of 3, two bosses(well, a sub-boss and THE boss), and there we go. It's got 3D graphics unlike the older games, though it's not Maximum Impact. 

And the game looks a lot better than it did in the initial pictures. The game that had everyone afraid has improved a lot, and we haven't even gotten the patch; the patch demo looks absolutely lovely. Now, I do have a personal preference for more Guilty Gear styled 2D fighters, however, this indeed looks fantastic, and the backgrounds/stages are gorgeous. 

Actually, there's a wonderful stage variety in general, and the music is solid as well. Personal favorites are probably the Industrial Area/Saxophone Under the Moon and The Neo Esaka/Yappari Esaka. (Respectively it's the Yagami Team and the Japan Team's stages/BGMs.) Love the amount of them too(19.) Here's a couple examples of their beauty:

And jesus that damn Follow Me song is catchy. 

https://youtu.be/UC_2riCDgSc?list=PLQU_mk2ibrEYOvWThj-YaDlUYxdVvswCV

(You can also hear it in its instrumental version.) 

The game does have it's ups and downs(more ups, but a few slight downs), but I'll get around to all of that. 


A quick rundown of the systems:


Max Mode, which allows you to access EX Special moves

Climax DMs, which are the Super Powered DMs

Super Cancels. You can cancel a normal DM into an EX or Climax DM, or an EX DM into a Climax DM(yeah, I won't get terribly deep here in the review, just running it down).

Rush combos, an autocombo that a beginner can use. Good for folks starting out but of course non-optimal. (They'll even tack on a special with meter.)

You have your other fare as well(Blow backs, rolls, run, a multitude of jumps and hops, and so on.) 

Modes offered are fairly varied: Story, Arcade, Versus, Tutorial, Training, Missions(which include Trials for each character, Time Attack, and Survival), a Gallery of stuff to unlock, and of course Online. 

This is a nice load of stuff to keep anyone busy I have to say. Casual players will appreciate the giant cast, the big gallery of unlocks, and the arcade/story mode.


Now I mentioned the game has its ups and downs. I'll go into some of both here!


-The new cast, IMO, is a mixed bag. Some standouts, but also many kinda boring/dull. 


While I get this is very subjective, for my money, the new cast, compared to OTHER new casts of the other sagas, its more middling I feel. So while I don't feel anyone is offensively bad(okay; Sylvie is a very polarizing character-I'm pretty indifferent though, so it's not an issue with me), I feel that there are only a few cool standouts. For some of the more 'meh':

-The Pachislot characters are just sorta...there. Like they don't really have much. I think Love Heart's pirate gig is kinda fun and she at least has a cool visual design and uses the rapier which is neat, and all but generally speaking they're...there. Like they are just sort of 'Playable Characters.' 

-Kim's new team members are two of the most generic characters like ever. He literally ended up with 'A Fighting Man Who Fights mixed with Dirty Old Man' and 'A Generic Kick Chick Who Flies Crotch First At People.' Yep, that's it. I mean the Fighting Man Who Fights(Gang-Il) has an iota of humor to him but he's still screamingly generic and the Generic Chick(Luong) is...like...that, a little flirty, that's it. They make '90s characters look vanilla. 

-Alice(another Pachislot character actually) is also 'Generic Idol Worshipper.' You all know the type. Nothing much else to say. Another generic trope that doesn't go much of anywhere. (And I'll get to something down the list: you CAN have more 'generic' tropes work, and I'll show you what I mean, since there IS a more 'generic trope' that I feel they nailed.) 

-As said, I'm neutral to Sylvie but I at least give her the credit of causing emotion with the playerbase one way or another. Definitely the polarizing character of the bunch. I don't care she's there, I'm not quite into that sorta design, I wouldn't miss her if she's gone but she doesn't raise my hackles or anything like that. 

-The end boss, Verse, for my money, is one of the more lame. I mean, in the story he definitely has a neat aspect about him(won't spoil it), but as a character? He's just Big Scary Monster Dude Thing who...isn't even that impressive in battle. This is KoF. An SNK game. Damint, I expect an impressive boss and he just sorta deflated. Plus he's pretty damn dull to boot except for the one interesting story aspect, so I felt this was a loss overall. 

-The South American Team is all fun, though doesn't really stand out to me. I think they're well designed visually(bright colors and cool outfits, okay save Banderias but he's a ninja, and Zarina has a pet toucan which is pretty adorable), and personality(they're definitely some of the more charismatic of the newcomers but still...not QUITE there for me.)

As for some more: 

-Shun'ei, the new sorta 'Kyo' of the game, is alright, pretty cool, decent design, though nothing super-impressive. I like his hair, and he does have a very 'Persona' like vibe to him I guess? I can definitely see him being attractive to some of those fans. He's inoffensive, but he definitely doesn't have Kyo's charisma IMO. Fighting style is pretty cool. Overall decent, nothing exceptional design wise. Pretty fun to play. 

-Mian is the role of 'Mysterious Shy Person.' I think Kyoshiro did the actor-fighter thing cooler in SamSho but she's alright. Nice outfit design though, and the shy/mask thing is kinda neat. Not someone whose my style to play but probably one of the more creative ones of the list. Also I think she'll fill in a spot on the Weirdo Team Fans(along with another newcomer. I don't necessarily mean like 'stancy complex weird' but 'yeah this characters kinda weird' weird.) 

-Kukri. This guy is major edgelord. However, he turns it up to Reaper levels of 15+ on the control past 10. In other words he's fucking hilarious in his edginess. You don't take him seriously at all. He throws shade at everyone all day.

-Hein is, IMO, the best newcomer. Now see; here's where they take a generic idea(Battle Butler), but actually manage to give him personality and charisma through use of little things; animation(just the way he walks is wonderful), his moveset(a bit sadistic at times for his appearance), his win quotes, and even the move names(they're all after chess pieces and moves, which gives you some insight.) It's possible, again, to take something generic and add to it. Lots of fun too. 

-Antonov is Big Loud Fun. Cigar-smoking over the top kinda guy who nonetheless displays some heart too. He's another trope that while I won't call him the most interesting man in the world, he is, again, at least fun in his design and writing. 

-Meitenkun is sort of my dark horse. He's usually not a type of chracter I play but something about the sleepy fella is pretty damn fun. I dunno what it is but he's just some apparently very powerful fighter(Tung Fu Rue says as much), who just loves his sleep. Like mid battle? Sure why not. (I think my current FFXV obsession is leading me to like sleepy people.) He's got a cool style about him and he's pretty fun in game too. (Arguably he might be another contender for a 'Weird Team Slot', even if he's not TOO weird. He's different.) 

-Xanadu is just weird, but I can totally see him being the Weird Character Player magnet for sure. He has some pretty funny moves. Like, this guy is likely going to lead many a Weird Character Player's teams. That said, not my bag. 

-The returning cast is solid, though not perfect. They nailed lots of classics. From of course the guys who will never go away(Iori, Kyo), the Fatal Fury team, the AoF team, Mai, King, the intact Psycho Soldiers team, Ikari Team, the whole nine. Mature and Vice apparently take form again to haunt Iori through yet another tournament(they're apparently spirits, remember, having been dead since '96....check out XIII sometime), Team Mexico is a lot of fun in their interactions(even if Tiz-ehm, King of Dinosaurs is the worst rudo ever), K's back in his grumpy glory, Benimaru is still over the top(give him back his belly shirt!), and you get the idea. That said, no Adelheid is a big minus(for me), and it IS still missing some good old favs, like Yashiro, Shermie and Chris. 

I've been running Iori as my anchor of course-I did it in '95 to '98 in locals, I did it casually for ages even though I moved heavily into Adel and Gato as team-mates(it worked out, Adel was a boss leader and I wasn't terribly serious anyway then), and that isn't likely to change anytime soon. Also-it's pretty awesome, as during his Climax Special(snerk), he seems to actively tap into the Riot of the Blood...voluntarily. Could this mean he actually has some measure of control of it? This is like when the Hulk gets control of his powers you realize. Keeping in mind Iori with his Yagami clan ties is far more powerful than the other Orochi tainted folks for a minute. This is scary. 

In addition I've been enjoying my usual K', Benimaru, Kyo, Kim, Terry and Robert, and out of the new characters as said Hein is amazing, and I quite like Meitenkun. Ramon is a lot of fun in this as well. 

I should say they've even done great with the win phrases here...to the point where they actually paid attention to a plot point from ages back from a manga in one of Iori's, which gets a big ol' kudos nod from me; it's little things like this(another example is in the new Tekken, Harada coming back to that old carving on the floor of the dojo), that make me smile in game lore. Hell, in the case of this, it's something you had to be a pretty heavy fan to even know about. In general though the returning characters keep well to their respective personalities, so no big changes here or anything. 

Something to note: many characters have new VAs. I have to say they do a hell of a job. It's not easy taking over for people who have voiced characters, in some cases, for two decades, especially some very iconic ones. That's got to be some pressure, and the performed admirably. 

That basically sums up my characters thoughts. I kinda feel if they had dropped a few of the snoozers/meh characters and added in some more returning folks it could have been like the best roster ever. I'd love to have had Jhun Hoon on the Kim team instead, to trade off a couple of say the Pachislot folks for Vanessa and Elisabeth, I'd love Duo Lon and I'd give my left goddamn kidney for Adelheid. 

On another side note, there are only four colors per character at the time of this writing-a bit low-but the upcoming graphical upgrade patch will be adding two more each. I can see more being added over time. In a time of many different outfits and colors it feels low but I'm confident we'll get more. It's nice to see they're listening. 


The tutorial is okay, but could use some fleshing out.


I feel it does a decent job of shooting people into the game, but some tips on timing cancels would have been nice for new players for sure, as well as explaining the concept of Battery, Middle, Control, and Anchor to people. That latter thing I think would have been really nice. New players going into a team game, while at first I imagine this won't affect, when they want to get in more, I dunno, I sorta feel like it would be nice to explain the concepts. (Now, as for what characters are excellent at what, some are cut and dry, some get debate, etc.) Just more explaining the basic concept of it could help out a bit with maybe a few tidbits on characters who are known at certain roles. Gods know with some of the personality the characters have they could have some fun with them explaining their spots. 

I do realize I'm spoiled by tutorials like VF4 EVO and GGXrd:R, so I tend to have very high expectations with these. For some this could be adequate(it does have good damage settings and such.) It's not bad at all I feel, but it could just cover some more. 

The game does not have the lowest learning curve. While casuals can pick it up and have a blast, getting more nuances down will take some time. I don't think it's that game that you have to devote to above ALL others(indeed, there are several people who play KoF with more games competitively), but be prepared to do some real drilling and muscle memory stuff cracking some of the harder stuff, and the game has different nuances than other 2D games to get used to and so on. But I definitely feel it's reasonable to get into, and even low level players can find some success in online matches after they learn some basics. There is a whole lot to dig into when it comes to high level play. 

Like most games some characters are simple to get into(Robert, Andy, Athena), some have 'easy to learn, harder to maximize'(Ryo, Iori-they at their core are not difficult, but to really get the most out of Ryo you need to master parries which will take some time to get right, and Iori is a rekka character which there are people who find them difficult to perform at will under duress), and then you have up to the tougher characters like Team Mexico in general(KoD isn't the easiest, Ramon is rather difficult and Angel is in with some of the other 'Nightmare to learn' characters) some like Chin are more on the difficult side, etc. (Psycho Soldiers IMO is a well-spread team, with Athena being the easier character, Kensou being a step up and Chin being the harder one.) This is, of course, fairly subjective, but it's an idea. There are plenty of resources around for new players looking to pick up folks. The KoF Reddit has plenty of info. 

On the competitive side, game balance is definitely more solid than XIII.

While certain characters certainly show up more often than others in top 8s and top 16s, there's a lot more variety in general. most top 8s see 12-16 different characters and most top 16s show off around half the cast. This is not bad, IMO. While it still has some bumps, the game on a competitive angle is a far cry better than the Mr. Karate/EX Iori/EX Kyo/Kim/Chin/Benimaru combos you saw all the time. It's perfectly okay I feel to see that common Benimaru or Robert, or that Iori anchor, and this still all happens, but the teams in general have a lot more variety at the moment. THAT Being said, it's not quite at, say, Tekken's level of balance. But it does well. Over time, I suspect they're going to keep an eye on things so it doesn't become the *X Character Show*(though, let's be frank, I suspect Kyo and Iori are going to stick. As well they should, damnit.)

Balancing team games, IMO, is pretty damned hard. I mean besides individual balance, certain characters are more or less powerful in certain positions, and so on. Iori and Terry can absolutely ruin your life bar with 800+ damage combos if they have meter to blow(like, not combo video material which like anyone can do a full life bar on but aren't particularly practical, like Chin needing six drinks, etc, but stuff that you see in tournament) and even with LOW meter they can do dangerous levels. But then there are others who might be able to do more impressive low meter combos...but not improve all that much. Or others who gain meter like it's water, etc. Others yet suck at meter gain. There are so many factors that actually nailing that balance is really tough, so again, I'm a little more forgiving here I think than I am in 1v1 games. (Especially when, say, even if you might see a lot of said Beni or Iori or K' or whatnot, they only take up 1 of three slots, and when you have a top 8 and most of the other characters are different? It's much different than seeing 4 Paul Phoenixes in 1v1.)


Wrapping it up:


While this 'review' was more of a discussion as I pointed out in the title, I figure I'll wrap up some thoughts here. 

The developers are really putting a lot of love into this game. What at first looked like a worrying PS2 level game made by people who may not get the game, is now a solid current-gen fighter which will be getting much prettier in January, for one! Look at these screenshots from the demo they have over in Japan:

https://twitter.com/arin_k_o_f/status/813363436545417216

https://twitter.com/SNK_Lover/status/813229342645960704

On top of this, there is plenty of content; you're getting your money's worth right away. And they're adding more outfits(classic outfits for some characters are already in), and they have stated they want to continue to strongly support this game for time to come with more. What that is? We won't know, but I'm almost expecting some character DLC down the line, more colors, more stages, who knows! I also like how the developers said they want to support the smaller tournaments and communities too. 

Really, grab it. It's more than worth it. I sorta wished I had grabbed it sooner at this point, though I'm glad I wasn't too late to get it. It's probably made it's way into my top 5 KoF games(keeping in mind my favorites are the '95-'97 years), one of my favorite games of 2016 and all of this time me chiming that I'll DEFINITELY be going casual with it, MOST definitely, since like, can I really play a whole THREE games competitively?

...Well, now I'm sort of being beckoned(re: ordered) over to the game now to start practicing my rekkas and hit confirms again on threat of being killed by a nasty clawing Climax Super Special. I can do 3 competitively with a family, right? 

So yeah, go buy it. Feed the community. Join the community. There are lots of great resources to get into it with. It deserves it. 

Capcom Cup, ft3, and Season 2 Characters

So for a big Street Fighter Blog Drop! This will deal with a bunch of stuff since I've been tied up in FFXV  real life and such. Yeah. Ahem. 

So for a quick analysis of the GFs Capcom Cup 2016(since a busy time prevented me from really watching huge amounts of it, though spoiler alert: Many brackets were ruined, I think that's already been discussed enough that I don't need to go too far into it here): 

I had put Du to win it after the top 8 in my heart, even though I called Du vs. Haitani, but Kazunoko's Temporary Door Power Up was too stronk. But after he was out, I had felt Du would do it. Had Kazunoko hadn't burned out(and I agree with a Twitter chat that he may have just burned out there that last losers finals), I don't think he'd have been able to take six full sets against Du. 

While Ricki played probably her best she ever did, and truly impressive overall, Du was just more consistent throughout the tournament. Most of Ricki's wins, with the sole exception of the decisive win against Kazunoko at thevery end, were 'Skin of her teeth' wins when you go back(tight comebacks, match points, low health, etc), and I felt that Du's consistency would play into this(Du's wins were dominant the entire time with 3-0's and 3-1's.) I also felt Du was more consistent throughout the year, as well(though with this tournament anyone could tell you that meant almost nothing.) 

Finally, Ricki's record vs. R. Mika, as great as she is, is not too good. Like I guess we all have that 'character weakness', that kryptonite if you will, and hers seems to be Mika(particularly Du's Mika when you look over old tournaments.) Her tweets said she trained a lot vs. Necalli(which paid off, but even then they were very close 3-2s and you could see the mad relief after the matches), and you could tell she put time into Chun mirrors as well(good thing because there were a lot of Chuns) but the Mika matchup just wasn't working out. Still, again, damned fine play! 

But yeah, we had 'murica up there! And Du's on total fire in SF right now. Well fought and well deserved. 


So moving on, I'd like to get to the discussion of how grueling this tournament was to be best of 3 the entire time. I saw some comments saying it was great, others saying it started to wear out its welcome, and others yet that said they were interested at first and then lost that interest.

So what do I think? I think the 32-person ft3 has it's upsides and downsides.

Upsides include a lot of hype, a lot of epic comebacks, and generally a better chance for folks to show their stuff. It also helps in a game like SF where matches(ft2) are over rather quickly. As we saw the brackets would have looked much differently if it was ft2. 

Downsides? The biggest is time. Sheer time. There's no way this could be done at EVO I feel; it needed a specialized tournament for SFV only. I don't think it could be done at something like CEO or anything else for that matter, without some serious planning or an extra day. Plus it can exhaust players on top of it. Exhausted players don't play to their best and can burn out. They can end up with lack of sleep which isn't great for one's health or mindset, and sometimes those 4 hour waits in between matches can be pretty terrible as well. 

My personal thoughts would be something in between. Top 8 I think should be ft3. I feel that, while it takes time, is probably doable under most tournament rules so long as stuff is solidly planned. Top 8 should give that extra set to prove oneself or make a comeback. Makes things epic, as said. 

Before that, though, there ARE more options than a generic ft2 for, say, top 32. These include:

-maybe making the actual matches best ft3 rounds instead. It works nicely for Tekken, and I wish Guilty Gear was like this as well.

-Round Robin. This is probably my first pick. Divide the top 32 into groups(8 groups of 4 for a clean top 8, four groups of 8, taking the 1st and 2nd place of each pool into the top 8), and everyone has to fight everyone else. It takes some time, but in a game like SFV where matches can go quick, even a ft2 in a round robin pool shouldn't take more than an hour each(and eight hours total to get to a top 8 is actually very reasonable, especially since SF tends to run pools one day and top 8 the next.) Even stretching things out, it should be doable, with again, planning, to conduct pools in this way. 

Now why do I like Round Robin? One aspect to traditional single or double elimination is the saying 'It's not always who you fight, but who you don't fight.' Meaning that there could be someone who you know could take you out, but someone else takes them out instead, but you happen to be decent against them...and so on. It happens; some folks are good at fighting some, but not others, some have character weaknesses. Round Robin gets rid of this somewhat. While you might be lucky in your particular pool, you need to fight every single person in that pool. You need to really show your stuff, having to fight a wide variety of playstyles, characters, and people. IMO it's a great way to fill out that top 8. 

Others' mileage may vary, of course. This is just my humble opinion.

In any case I think this could keep the hype, while still making the top 8 3/5 but actually making it a viable tournament option for situations that you can't spend 30 hours actually fighting in one game. 

And finally, there was an interesting tweet! I screencapped the tweet, for a reason(this is from my FB):

So this tweet was deleted. They were showing apparent line-ups with the shadows. These seem to match up fairly nicely, truth be told; at first I thought the guy at the end looked like Garuda, but he's too slender; Garuda is pretty big. Same with Sodom. 


Of course I saved the bigger picture, so here you go(can click to expand):

Okay, so first off, let me make clear: These are rumors. I'll say again: These are rumors. We don't have any guarantee that these are the people in the pictures; they're someone's guess, but I'm willing to allow myself to get a little hype here, because the tweet was taken down, without any 'Lol JK' or anything like that. Which sort of sets off a small flag, so to speak. 

Now across the board we have(their names can be found on various SRK posts who posted teasers of this art in the first place some time back): 

Helena: The girl from the DLC story. Don't want to go too much into her but I can easily see her being in the game. No idea of style or whatnot. 

Goutetsu:  Akuma and Gouken's trainer. This guy actually would have some point, too, being Akuma is in. Would actually make some sense. 

McCoy: This fella is on Cammy's Delta Red team. Not much is known about him, he appeared in a picture with her and some others. I heard a couple of rumors he might be an engineer type but that's ALL I've heard, I have zero conformation(it might be people just taking a stab guessing the bombs and weaponry he has on him.) Could be interesting to have a big, heavy zoner? 

Satsuki: One of the dolls. She looks like a ninja type. I wonder if she could be for someone who wants a less-technical ninja(Ibuki is pretty technical, plus is a negative edge character.) 

Rook: Probably the most fleshed out of the bunch-okay, it's still thin, but there's something. Rook was in Capcom Fighting Allstars, and he actually has some gameplay as you can see here in a couple of places(note: this game was very rough, in beta, and probably cancelled because it wasn't too great, but thankfully they're looking at salvaging some of the characters): 

He has a heavily kick-based style as it says in his background. Has some awesome moves like a much more brutal variant of Kim Kaphwan's diving air multi stomp.

This guy will easily become a highly played character of mine if he's in. 

So yeah, like, here's hoping? I would be plenty okay with this lineup. It's pretty diverse in terms of design and there could be some nice playstyle variety here too. Will keep an eye on things and see how they pan out. 

All of that being said I kinda wish Capcom had done some patching of the game this year. I know some people favor less patching; I'm not saying go NRS with it, but I feel Bamco gets it right. If they see something going haywire, they balance it. (See Akuma.) Somewhere in the middle. There's a middle ground to a lot of things. Hopefully S2 sees more overall variety in tournaments. I think by knocking down the top pegs a little and buffing the lower, plus adding this bunch, we'll see just that, one can hope. 

Anyhow that's enough for me for now! I'll return again to chat soon about some other fighting game stuff! And maybe even some NON fighting game stuff for FFXV. Since I'm totally hooked on that right now.

Oh yeah, Garou: Mark of the Wolves is like 15 bucks on PSN right now and has netplay. So like, get it. 

Thoughts of Tekken 7!

So the time had finally came and went that I got to play some Tekken 7!

I got to play it for about two days, for a total of about fifteen or sixteen matches. My performance was good enough for the situation-sadly, the place only had pads in the testing area and were more like just those general stations you might see in a store or something. I'm pretty terrible on a pad these days(not to mention they make my hand hurt, something a stick doesn't do even after a long time on one), but I managed to at least function well enough to win more than lose. 

I only played Dragunov(wait, I played Claudio for a single game, but it was vs. a brand new player, and I didn't want to go on a roflstomp mode. Yeah, Claudio's pretty awesome but at least I have no idea how to use him besides db+3, b+1, hopkick, d+2,2 and WR2. I don't know his combos), but that was enough for me; I wanted to get a good feel for what Dragunov would be like in the game. And even in ver. B(yeah, THAT version), he felt freaking fantastic. 

The game overall felt smooth and fun; I had no issues with the controls beyond me sucking at playing pad, but the actual game felt very nice. Movement felt nicer, the game looked crisp(it was the PS4 version as well and I was looking at it right close), sure, the Super PC version may/will probably end up looking better but I can assure people that this is going to look just fine. 

I got one picture but it's terrible and blurry but I'll post it anyway:



Proof! 

Now, again, ver. B was the Crazy Buff Akuma version, and yes, I fought many of him. He is very jarring to fight the first few times, as my brain wanted to default to Street Fighter with him...and IMHO, the times I did the best vs. him(I had just over a 50% win rate vs. these Akumas, no, none were Poongko level of course but a couple were actually pretty damn good), were the times that I sort of managed, for lack of a better term, to force him to play Tekken. I DO feel that the jump-in game feels a bit off in Tekken; I would prefer he worked a little more on Tekken's rules(though keeping the fireballs and meter, so long as the meter is more throttled like it is in later versions.) The fireballs and meter I think are kinda okay, but the jumping I'm not sure feels great. Maybe we'll get used to it. (Hell, I'd take a guaranteed anti-air move given to each character.) Games in the high teens may not be enough to tell. I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt...

...Especially since the rest of the game really is SO fun! I really do think that this game is going to bring back that old feel when Tekken was in it's bigger days. I was watching brand new players come up to play several games and just having fun with it, having no idea about the game yet they were enjoying all of the effects, the colorful characters, and so on. This bodes well for a time not unlike the time of Tekken 3. 

Again going back to my main; Dragunov just felt so natural in my hands. 7.0 Dragunov felt awesome, but this version felt even better. New properties added to some moves(and we don't even have the best ones added yet, those come in a later version), his new outfit looks amazing in person, his Rage Art is the coolest and most satisfying one to hit, IMO, and his Rage Drive is great fun to play with. As was with 7.0, some combos are easier to land(as is with many characters), but optimization still takes chops, which IMO is a good balance. 

I really like how Rage Drives work-while I was more experimenting with it since I couldn't theorycraft too much in the way of combos, but it's going to be a lot of fun to utilize I think in a live game. Rage Arts I feel are either best for those YOLO comeback moments(though I feel RD's will be able to be better optimized for damage on stages with walls and floors.) I kinda think that RAs don't scale enough in combos at the moment(in fact, I'd argue that on an open stage one can squeeze more out from an open-ground combo ending with an RA than using an RD since the RA still does a good 15% or so in a combo), but on stages with breaks I think the RD is going to shine. For an example, Dragunov can do one of his fat combos on the temple stage, end with the spike, break the floor, more combo, more wall, and probably damn near kill them since the spike enders tend to be nasty. 

I do think that the damage should be kept a little in check; in ver. D in the videos it may still be a little high overall(I mean, in general), and while Tekken's always been a game of 'Risk losing 50-60% if you mess up', I sort of think 'Risk losing 75-90% in a 1v1 game with no red life or tag outs' is a little too much, and mostly it's the RDs that are the culprits. Still, I think they are taking this feedback in mind and will work with things. The game still has a couple of months to balance, I reckon! I also admit that still, the new cast leaves me a little uninspired compared to past offerings, but I do like Shaheen's design and Claudio's playstyle a lot(I actually like some of Claudio's alt outfits better than his primary.) I do like his SNK boss shout-out, though. (And as a side note, Shaheen seems more rounded than he did in 7.0, with gameplay adjustments that make him less one-note, so good job listening to feedback there.)

Really all in all I see this as being 'The New Tekken 3', in a sense. It's more balanced, it's bigger, it's more in depth, but it also has those great new things to attract the new and more casual audience, or it has the potential to. If they keep going with that cool story mode idea(making sure lots of characters get their share of time), have extra stuff to appeal to that audience, and also making sure there are things like a great training mode, I'm totally seeing it.

C'mon, early 2017. You're almost here!

(PS: This was less in-depth mechanically and more an overall 'how it felt' post, which I know is a little different from my usual posts chucking out frame data left and right, but I felt it more proper for this one.) 

SFV Wishlist

Whew, hopefully I'll be back more often for awhile from my RL little mini-hiatus. 

On a side note, I'll be at DigiExpo here in Helsinki this weekend(probably after four on Friday for about three hours, but most of the day Saturday and a fair bit Sunday) playing some Tekken 7 on PS4! I'm very much looking forward to it. I don't think I'll be able to enter the tournament as I'm not going to be able to be on the premises for the entire time on Saturday; but we'll see. I'd like to try even if it'll be my first anything in like fifteen years! 

Okay so this blog is going to have a non-Tekken bent for the rest of it!

I'll go over what my overall wishlist for Season 2 of SFV is.

Disclaimer: It's no lie that SFV has disappointed me as a product somewhat. I think it's a good figthing game wrapped up in a lot of missteps, and I feel they really need to regain some goodwill with the audience in Season 2. I'm not big on the story mode(weird, disjointed, nonsensical, screws up potential good storylines for comedy, and that's just the tip of the iceberg), Survival mode was a pain, the DLC is starting to creep into DOA prices, and yeah. So this wishlist will be more than characters. 

Also: I'm more casual when it comes to SF these days. Thing is I just don't have a ton of time as many here know; between Tekken, Guilty Gear(hell, I need to squeeze a lot more time out for Guilty Gear as it is!) and other games that I like I simply don't have time to devote to too many fighting games as more than casual; anything beyond these two-like King of Fighters-are like just to sorta be like party games for me and stuff to branch myself out more with. So I don't have a massive horse in the race, but being a fighting game fan I DO like to see well tuned and well put together games. 

I also want to touch on how it's apparently moved less than 100k copies since it's last report. It's come in under it's 2m target. While the CPT has been a success and it's doing great in terms of the competitive game, it really, really hurt itself with its launch. I sort of feel their intent to launch with the more 'Killer Instinct-ish' type of model(perhaps?) wasn't a bad idea, but they went around it wrong. It sort of feels...chaotic or something, like they aren't exactly sure what direction they wanted to go. 

In any case, here are some things I'd like to see!

Game Wishlists:

-At this point I'm going to say 'I don't mind that the story has comedy, as characters like Zangief and Mika are made for it, but could we maybe try to get some stuff on some rails somewhere?' I can't even get into specifics so much weirdness and wtf happened with it. Just...get it on some rails maybe. I don't expect fighting game stories to be miracles(in fact, I tend to expect retcons and weirdness all the way down with most of them the longer they go on), but...this one was really weak, IMO. Rashid was probably one of the crowning achievements as he actually balanced funny with serious fairly well. 

-More modes. Better tutorial. Make sure you give casual players something. 

-A balance pass. I agree with a tweet I saw of Ultradavid; rather than do a lot of nerfing, give some small nerfs to the tip-top, but do more to bring the bottom up. I've mentioned a few times I'm a fan of this sort of balance; it makes everyone feel more awesome than bringing the top down. Granted this only works when the top isn't too inflated over the bottom(in which case, you need to bring the top down more-as I mentioned in my tier thread the top shouldn't be TOO crazy)-and to give SFV credit, it IS pretty good there; the top 3-commonly seen as Ryu/Chun/Insert Nash, Necalli or Ken here last I checked, are not head and shoulders above the rest, they just have a load of favorable matchups. But it's still noticeable that the top 8's and 16's have a lot of similar characters in them. 

-Some sort of cohesive marketing idea. Keep to a decent DLC schedule. Maybe sell the base game for a little less. Maybe cut down the prices of some of the DLC(some of it is getting a little high, IMO. No, I'm not anti DLC-but I do feel it's getting a little out of hand.) Maybe have a concrete way to market this thing to the masses. 

Character Wishlist:

I'm going to pick a few. And...since they actually have updated artwork of Arika characters? I'm going to add them to the list too. I mean, if they're going to tease me with them, I'm going to hope for them!

Doctrine Dark: D. Dark is one of my all-time favorite SF characters. I mean crazy military guy and all. I was one of those EX fans back in the day, and it would be REALLY grand if they add this guy to the mix. It would be awesome to see how they build on his old moveset and tweak him. He's probably my top pick for entering. (If he's in, this SF will literally have like every favorite of mine.)

Skullomania: Yes, another EX character. Why not? This guy's amazing. So over the top and goofy. He's like part Sentai part dude in pajamas. He'd be a ton of fun I think  in SFV's system too! He's a well-liked character who I think would be quite appreciated coming in. He'd get along with Rashid too.

Cody: I always loved Cody and man, I'd love to get our badass prison dude back up in here. They should totally make his V-Trigger something where he breaks his shackles and goes off, too. He'd fit into SFV well I think and be a welcome overall addition. Dude is popular as hell too, so he'd be one of those guys I think would go over real well!

Sodom: Sodom is a big dork and he TOTALLY needs to be in another Street Fighter game. Oh please let him be in another Street Fighter game. I remember when Sodom was rumored at one point I got all happy, but then it never came to be and I had a sad. I think he'd slot in pretty easily and be some comic relief(since they seem to be going that route anyway with SFV so might as well pick a legitimately goofy character.) 

Rose: Rose remains my favorite SF gal, and I think she'd be in a game with Bison since she's still sort of trying to go after him(or would still be at this point.) With SFV's thin amount of zoners, she'd fit in very nicely, and again, I'm biased toward her anyway. Plus her and Guy are pretty adorable. She'd be pretty cool in this system I think! 

Necro: While I personally might wait a season, I DO like Necro and feel he'd add some fun to the cast. He's not a Sim clone despite being stretchy(I think this patch would end up doubling the amount of actual zoners in the game), but I feel they could build him as being a bit more aggressive while still reachy and with his lightning fun. 


All of this being said, I would have Guy and Poison slated for backup; however, given I want two EX characters in this bunch, I think maybe Season 3 would be awesome to bring in Guy, Poison, Hugo and maybe Haggar to complete the Final Fight gang. (I'd probably put in Blanka and Sakura as the SF picks for S3; If S2 ended up with eight picks, we could put in Blanka and Sakura here.) 

Feels about right to me anyway! Guess we'll find out what they think. 

So yeah, just wanted to give a blurb here. I want to like this game more, and again think it's a good game, but damn, as a product the thing needs help. Here's hoping they see what they need to do and fix it up. I'd like to see more fighting games doing better, not less!

Apologies for the short silence!

Ahoy all!

Things have been a bit on the busy side here, so I've been slow on the blogging front. I do have a few things I've been chipping away at that I'll post soon, though!

We've had some colds going around the house, I've been working on a couple of other projects on top of that, and some other odds and ends so blogging time has been a little shorter. 

Hopefully I'll be back on a more regular schedule starting this week!

Review: The Dark History of Mishimas

The Dark History of Mishimas-the elusive Tekken novel that has gone untranslated for a long time-was finally translated and has been for sale on Amazon since August! So I grabbed it today. 

I feel it's very well done! Certainly like...gods I wish we got this instead of Blood Vengeance so hard. I hope, one day, maybe we will get it. I can keep that wish! 

Okay. FAIR WARNING: HERE THERE BE SMALL SPOILERS. I will not of course give away endings or results or anything, BUT, I am going to do a review, and it will give some synopsis, so if you want to go in 100% blind, then you might want to skip. I will block off the part where I get to spoiler territory. 

So! Without further ado...

In the footnotes it describes that it was based on the arcade version of Tekken 6; this would be pre-Scenario Campaign. Now, while this is licensed work, there are parts of this novel that REALLY should have been remembered by Lars in the Scenario Campaign(you'll definitely know them when you see them) if it were actually canon. In addition, it's pretty clear some of this story is retconned to what's going on in Tekken 7 anyway,  and there are other liberties taken here and there as well with some of the game material. So for my money? It's best just to read it as it's own work and enjoy it for what it is. 

So to say it short: It's an official novelization for the Tekken 6 arcade game, but does not seemed to be referenced in SC, and is somewhat retconned by 7. (I should note: Just because this is 'official', it could be this is one of the retconned pieces rather than the game. It's sort of hard to tell. After reading this I'll have to do some piecing together.) 

Okay with THAT out of the way, to give a brief synopsis(it's not the longest read, more like a short novel):

Leading up to what we know of Tekken 6; it deals mostly with the Mishimas, their past(at the time of the writing; again, this seems to have been retconned somewhat or changed somehow, I am not completely sure, we'll know more with 7), and some events leading up to what I'm guessing is Bloodline Rebellion. 

The other characters involved are mostly sort of backdrops; they serve as foils, and in Raven's case, his role seems to be that of the guy that Heihachi(who is the story's Mr. Exposition when it comes to the background) explains everything to so the reader learns it. Besides Kaz, Hei, Jin, and Lars and the aformentioned Raven, Dr. B, Eddy, Nina, Anna, Bruce, Dragunov, and (sort of), Jinpachi make appearances(Jane and the Jacks make a small appearance as well). As mentioned, this story IS pretty firmly on the Mishimas, so the rest don't get too much in the way of backstory or anything. They have a purpose, at least. 

It goes into the backstory of the Mishimas, their family, the Devil, various other demons and how it passes from family member to family member. Essentially, if you want to know the background to the Mishimas, as it was before the Devil Gene stuff took hold, you'll find a take of it here. 

It's opening scene is a pretty good doozy, I'll say that much, with Lars essentially watching Jin slaughter some poor mooks; someone should have told them not to pick the ones who were all one day from retirement. It branches out to some travels around-touching on some of the other characters and their journey to discover Jin's current location and...I'll leave it at that and let you read the rest. Because it's short, I can't really say too much without spoiling too much of it. 

That being said, I'll try:






Incoming mild spoilers. If you wish to skip these, pass over until I say 'spoilers end.' I do not spoil any major outcome, just a couple of more minor fights. 







So I have to say, one thing that had me completely happy was the fact that besides the four Mishimas(Kazuya, Jin, Lars and Heihachi), the most badass motherfucker in this story? It was Dragunov. Dragunov manages to not only tire Lars out to the point where a normal is able to temporarily knock him out, he puts out Anna and Bruce with a quickness that's scary(he knocks them out faster than Heihachi takes to body Nina and Eddy who are likewise 'normals', so to speak), and is not knocked out himself until a certain supernatural guy whose name begins with D and ends with Jin kinda wakes up and explodes(and then his ass isn't even *knocked out*.) Oh yeah, there's a trail of corpses leading up to the area where him and Lars were fighting. (Keep in mind in a story with some pretty graphic fights and some mook deaths...they do not describe what Dragunov and Lars did to these guys. Think about that for a moment.) He lives up to his name, and while his only role is sort of...well, his storyline(he's sent to collect Jin, just like the game), he basically proves he's incredibly dangerous. Please for the love of the gods Bamco, give him his intro in Tekken 7 where he gets to body dudes. I was fangirling so damned hard during his short scene. Like I got that vindication that my boy is actually one of the more powerful and badass characters in the series and I never knew this. 

I'm also just going to say the Lars vs. Kazuya fight is amazeballs and that's all I'm saying. I will say, between all of Lars' scenes-and his Scenario Campaign intro-do not piss him off. Seriously. You'll regret it. Hard. Lars only looks like a nice guy. He will fucking wreck every bone in your body. 

Jin is a monstrous fighter. Like making me cringe at times. It's awesome, though. He's also naked a lot. Long story. 

I don't even want to spoil the end fights. Not even in the spoiler section. 








Spoilers end here. 









With the basics out of the way, I'm going to hit up what I feel it's strongest and weakest points are!


Strongest Points!


They do a really nice job with a lot of the characterization! Heihachi is actually written with some depth and nuance. Jin's sort of 'mental battles'(you'll see) are well-exposed, Kazuya is certainly on point as the Kazuya we've come to know, and Lars is that great mix of 'Obviously more caring guy who nonetheless is a total hardass who will wreck your shit.' Dragunov, while he doesn't talk, is nonetheless a clearly scary man. 

The fight scenes are very well done for the most part. While mooks get bodied pretty quick and easy, the fights with a lot of the big players are very cool to awesome(some are incredibly short, for those who read the mild spoiler box. ;)) The writer actually got the fighting styles down, too. Lars, for example, using his Entry moves, Dragunov getting noticed for both his ground game and utilizing a lot of his trademark big nasty kicks he has in game. The Mishimas, naturally, utilize their Mishima style Karate. (Also, Bruce spams b+2. I freaking died.) Everyone has their styles basically accurate, so kudos to them. (You really get an idea of just how powerful the Mishimas are in this, too. Including Lars, jesus. He's wonderful.) 

The take on the story is really solid, and I very much enjoyed the background chapters of the history further back of the Mishima clan. 

To be completely honest, most of this was 'ups.' If I pointed out all the ups, I'd be pointing out most of it, I really would. 


And now for some weaker aspects: 


One down I have is the lack of Lee, actually. Lee is a Mishima by adoption, and I sort of feel that they could have maybe helped the pacing(see below) by having some bonus bits with how he's doing with the family as well. While he and Lars don't meet until the Scenario Campaign(and again, see how this may not actually tie 100% in due to events not being remembered), I kinda feel there was a slight missed opportunity, especially since in Tekken 7 they're going to be going heavier into how he and Kazuya have their big thing. At the same time, I can maybe understand that they didn't want to stretch the story too thin; so it's a minor quibble, but he also could have had some wonderful fight scenes as well with his style. 

The pacing IS a bit wonky. You can kinda tell that the author was trying REAL HARD to get to Ultimate Throwdown of DOOOM and Awesomeness, and as a result, I feel a fair bit of the story was a little too fast-moving, and some of the other cast glossed over a bit much. I'm not saying they needed big parts, but Dragunov is pretty much just used to show he's a badass(which, again, I appreciate XD), Nina and Eddy are basically literally just there because they work for the Zaibatsu and...that's about it, and Bruce and Anna are a couple of small wrenches to be thrown into the gears(Anna basically playing the role of what counts as this story's comic relief, for my money, since she definitely got the most laughs out of me.) Dr. B. is a bit of exposition. As mentioned, Raven is the recipient of exposition, more for the reader's sake. Essentially, the pacing is 'Setup, Stuffhappens COOL STUFF stuffhappens BIG THROWDOOOOOWN.' It might be a bit jarring for some.

I feel both the pacing and the rest of the cast could have enjoyed a little more if the story was a bit longer, actually. I actually feel the story may have been a tiny bit too short for what it wanted to do. While I think it's great they focused the most on the Mishimas, I think a bit more length would have provided a little more for the rest of the crew. I also do think some of the characters' personalities could be hit or miss-while some were strong above, people like Eddy and Nina were sorta...they had some things, but they were kinda muted. 

Finally the dialogue does reach some cheesy levels. Like, I had to stop myself from laughing a couple of times levels of cheesy. It can be a bit of a 'video gamey' esque dialogue, for lack of a better description. Definitely a bit of goofball factor. 


As I mentioned, though-don't let the longer neutral/down section turn you off. It's only because i had to be more specific with them since the overall strong points basically boil down to 'Most of the story', so that's a good thing!


Final Thoughts:


All in all though, it was a really good and entertaining read. It gives a bit of a different and bizarre take of the Mishima story, and given this was an officially sanctioned novel in the footnotes, I believe a lot of this stuff is actually not too farfetched in the past Tekken storyline, anyway(retcons notwithstanding.) It's a light read, to be sure-any moderately fast reader will be done fairly quickly, I think(I finished it in a morning), but it's a quality one. If you're a Tekken fan, who wants some actual quality licensed/official material even if it's a different take on what we'll be getting in the canon games going forward, I highly suggest you drop the 10 bucks on it. I bought it and I have no regrets at all. 


Anyway, this review isn't mean to be a big, comprehensive thing, but just some bits of info on it, and me telling you that if you're a fan of Tekken lore and want some enjoyable stuff with it, definitely grab this for a really great take on stuff. 

You can grab it here!

Lee's full body render added to official site, his and Miguel's bios added

Well look what we have here! Lee and Miguel added to the official site!

(If you'd like to see some other pictures, their links are here and here respectively.)

I don't have full translations of the stories yet; Lee's was translated from before and basically sums up his story of ho he was adopted by Heihachi as a rival, was fired from the TZ, now works against both Hei and Kaz and backs Lars in the process(I'm so glad they kept that since I love the Mishima Bastards working together.) There is that part of me that wants to see those two come out on top of it all in terms of the family. 

I'd take a gander that Miguel's storyline involves him chasing down Jin for killing his sister. Just throwing that out there. I'd guess it's from his video dialogue. Plus that's what his whole story has surrounded and all, and he DOES still have that unfinished business with Jin. And after finding it on the site, it's exactly it; he's in for revenge against the Zaibatsu, and he's angry. 

Anyway, while we just saw Miguel's new render, this is the first time we've seen Lee's new full body render(we saw the original.) The swag cannot be contained. That Mafia coat, the smirk, it's all perfect. They even threw the rose onto Violet for good measure! I love it. 

Anyway, this should be good for updates today! I shall return with some new writeup stuff soon I think. I may even try to deal with multiple games since this IS an FGC blog and all and not just a Tekken blog! 

And the next character is...

And the next character is...

http://www.avoidingthepuddle.com/news/2016/10/8/tekken-7-miguel-character-reveal-trailer.html

Miguel! Thanks to AvP with the news as usual.

Direct link to the official release video:

Alrighty then! Just announced at the Barcelona event was Miguel, and I am damned happy to see him. I was happy with my lineup-I had my main, I had my main subs, and I had my backups, and even my dabble characters...Miguel was the only one I was truly missing, and here he is! I honestly would have been fine any way, but getting him is like a great bonus.

Miguel, IMO, is like a perfect fit for Tekken 7. He has a fairly simple, bread and butter, no-frills no bullshit style that's great for new players but can still be involved enough for more experienced players. He has a stance, he's poke-heavy, and will I feel slot right into this system nicely. His combos look solid, though nothing too extreme in terms of difficulty. 

His new design is fantastic; that coat fits him great, those knuckledusters are just huge-like the size of sledgehammers, and he just looks so angry. Which fits him. I mean the guy has a big beef with Jin with the death of his sister and all. Also he makes eating an apple look badass. 

For some moves listings(not in order at the moment, but just going through some information and the video): 

-His Power Crush seems to be b+4. Nice fitting one, too. The animation is good for a PC. I do wonder though if they'll leave it safe. As of now it's 19f,  and -6 on block, but a safe, mid, KND/W! PC may be pretty strong; most of the loaded PCs(Backlash, what looks to be HMS3 though I dunno that on block) are high. THAT being said the move is very, very linear, so they may get away with leaving it safe, or at least maybe -9. They could test it out and see how it runs. 

-He seems to have a tailspin that is based off of a new move, presumably replacing his old df+2,2. It is unknown what the notation is, but the df+2 seems intact. It may still be the same notation, and they just changed the move. 

-3,4 has a tailspin. 

-He has some cool kick that resembles a WS4 after his f+1+2. New, or changed animation?

-He seems to have a WS+2,4 like tailspin(new or adjusted move?)

-At the wall he seems to have an uf+3 option into a string that spikes; this could be really damned good for him at the wall to give him a consistent and scary wall option. (it appears with some searching the latter hits of his WS+2 string, but we'll see. In any case, it's good.)

-SAV 4 gives a tailspin. 

-His RD seems to be another screw-type one. I'm not sure this is the choice I'd have made for Miguel, but we'll see how it goes. 

-His Rage Art may be one of the coolest in the game. That first person beatdown. Once again those knuckledusters are fucking huge. 

It's also awesome they threw in some of the fanservice 'Whoo-hoo!' I was waiting for that and they delivered! 

So all in all a good choice. While there's a few detractors(mostly people waiting for some OGs, which some I have sympathy for, however I have zero for the people spamming Harada), in general, and he's not one of those super-polarizing characters like capos or Bob(I have less of a problem with these characters than others, but they are polarizing, and IMO capos are probably better left out of this one unless they have a REALLY big re-working, the biggest of any character). He's not a completely unplayed character(even if he isn't super-popular). He has a point in the story; his beef with Jin will be able to perhaps spice up the Mishima war a bit(Jin will likely be fighting a war on both sides here.) 

I'll be back soon for a bit more roster chat!